The Tortoise Table

Hi all, sorry another newbie post!
So have had my adorable 6month old Hermanns for 16days and he is yet to poop which is worrying me! Eating is also an issue, where I have been researching we should put calcium on his fresh leaves everyday (and nutrobol a couple times a week) however he will not touch his food with it on, so sometimes I give in and give him some bits like curly kale with nothing on in the hope he will get some…….also have cuttle fish which I smear with cucumber but won’t touch it! So currently I bath him daily and he has a nice wee but he is yet to poop 16days on and So naturally I’m panicking!! Im booked in with vet for general check up but it’s not until Tuesday………. He is in a table with coco coir as substrate mixed with tortoise life bio which the shop provided. He is under a mixed lamp, with a basking temp of 32 and about 21 degrees at the other end, no heat at night. He has loads of plants in with him but hasn’t touched them. When should I be worried? Is there anything I should be doing differently?? Thanks in advance!!

Can anyone help with the above?? Please!

Hi Damo,

We are so very sorry to have missed your posts! Over the last few weeks something has gone wrong with our notification system, whereby we are supposed to be notified each time something new is posted -- sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't, and we have been finding posts that we weren't notified about and haven't answered. It's especially worrying when someone is desperately asking for help or advice like you are, so I hope you will accept our apologies.

First of all congratulations on acquiring your tortoise, and it sounds to me like you have given him a good set-up. Your temperature range seems OK, although 32C is a teeny bit high (we tend to prefer 30C), but as his cool end is 21C then it means if he is too warm he can always walk over to a cooler place. Can I ask where you are measuring the temperature at the warm end? It needs to be measured directly below the heat source and at the height of the tortoise (a thermometer mounted on a nearby wall will give you an artifically low reading and it could well be much hotter under the lamp). Having said all that, it shouldn't really have affected his appetite.

Regarding his pooing -- if he isn't eating much then he won't be pooing much. Also as he is only 6 months old, his poos will be tiny. Do you think they could have got covered up by his substrate if he is walking around? Bathing him daily or every other day is exactly the right thing to do, so you can ensure that he is well hydrated.

Regarding his eating. Tortoises can be very fussy and stubborn, and can go a long time without food, but they won't starve themselves, so you just need to be firm and not give in. It's true that many tortoises don't like the taste of Nutrobal and sometimes you have to trick them into eating it (but if he's not eating much of anything then this is difficult). I would maybe hold off on the Nutrobal for a little bit, until you get him eating and find something he really likes, and then you can make a little sandwich out of a leaf he likes with a tiny bit of Nutrobal in the middle and hand feed it to him. Hand feeding in general isn't recommended, because they get used to it and want you to hand feed them all the time, but in this case I think it's warranted. I think the instructions for Nutrobal are something like a pinch of Nutrobal per kilo of tortoise, so you only need a teeny tiny bit of it.

You mentioned that you smeared the cuttlefish with cucumber (good idea and shame it didn't work). I think it might be good to try it the other way around. I would wet a bit of Kale or something, and with your fingernail scrape some cuttlefish onto the Kale (it will stick because the leaf is wet), and then try that with him.

You mentioned that you were booked in with a vet for a check-up, and I hope that went well. Do you know if he/she was an 'exotics' vet? It's really important that any vet you see for a tortoise has qualifications or a special interest in 'exotics', which includes reptiles, as ordinary vets often don't know a lot about tortoises and give the wrong advice. We have a list of recommended vets on our website.

I do hope that by now he is eating well and pooing too, but let us know if you are still having problems. In the meantime, by way of an apology for our late response to your post, would you like a complimentary copy of our Tortoise Observation Records booklet? It's a place to keep all your records on one place (vet details, changes of equipment, growth (weight and length) records, etc. If you'd like one, just email me at nina@thetortoisetable.org.uk with your name and address and I'll pop one in the post to you.

If you'd like to post a photo of your set-up, we might be able to suggest a few tweaks that will motivate him to eat, but it does sound from your description that your set-up is fine.

Nina

Hi Damo,

Whew -- that's a relief that he seems to be OK. I do think tortoises secretly enjoy seeing us squirm and wring our hands in despair!

Re the temperature -- digital probes are absolutely fine. I use fridge/freezer thermometers with a probe on the end of a long wire and hang it down from above so that it is as close to the circle of light as possible, and about the height of his shell. By resting it on the ground you might be measuring the temperature of the substrate (which could be a degree or two higher because it is absorbing and retaining some heat). Some people bury the wire of the probe in the substrate and then have the probe sticking up out of the substrate, which can work well, but tortoises can also trample over it. If you don't have anything above that you can hang the probe from, you can improvise -- I have sometimes taped a chopstick to the rim of the wall of the table, so that it projects inwards towards the light and then I wind the cord around that and hang it off the end so that it hangs down to the right height. And I use a thermometer that has a Max/Min facility, so that you can see how hot or cold it got since you last looked. Have attached some not very good photos.

Regarding feeding. It's true that Nutrazu isn't very good. It's got all sorts of things in it that tortoises normally wouldn't eat (soybeans, corn, molasses), and 15% protein content is way too high (tortoises need high fibre and low protein), so I wouldn't advise feeding it. HOWEVER -- as a temporary measure you could try this. Moisten a bit of Nutrazu until it is really soft, like a paste. Smear a a good amount on a leaf and offer it to him. He will get the Nutrazu and can't avoid the leaf because the Nutrazu is stuck to it. Very gradually, over a week or two, reduce the amount of Nutrazu on the leaves you are offering, until there is only the teeny tiniest bit left, and then stop it altogether. By that time he will (hopefully) got used to the leaves and won't need the Nutrazu.

I'm so glad you saw a good exotics vet, and that he didn't have any worries. I think your tortoise (what's his name by the way), will be fine -- it might just take a little time to get him eating properly, but he will eventually.

Do email me your photo -- nina@thetortoisetable.org.uk -- and I will reduce it for you and post it here. And also send me your address if you'd like the booklet I mentioned in the previous post.

Have also attached a photo of my Doris and Dolly, who wish your tortoise much sunshine and hearty meals!

Nina
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Oh no! I'm so sorry, but when I was adding photos to my post above, I somehow managed to delete your post, and now I don't know how to get it back! I'm obviously having a terrible day (technologically speaking).

For anyone else who is reading this, Damo's tortoise visited the vet and was pronounced well and healthy. He is energetic and well hydrated, but still not eating a lot. Damo had tried him with Nutrazu, which he liked, but on other forums people said it wasn't good and shouldn't be fed. I agree with that but have suggested a temporary measure to get him eating. I think that is most of it, but please do post again if there is something I haven't answered.

I can't believe that I've inadvertently deleted your post, and I don't think that it is currently hiding somewhere where it can be recovered and re-posted, so many, many apologies!!!

Nina
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